Amusing. This has been public knowledge for just under a week. China Y 20s, flew thru NATO airspace? Countries fly routes over countries daily. The load manifest was made public, the flight routes are open source on flight tracker. The flight, the cargo is nothing fishy, just taking care of business. What’s interesting is the likeness of the Y-20 and our own C141 aircraft.
I did not watch the silly stuff. But I’m guessing within the length of vid, the question of where are those missiles really going, was addressed. That’s the question.
Lady’s and Gentleman, like it or not WWIII has arrived.
AND today, the Polish Govt outright accused Russia of shooting down Polands leadership back in 2010. Think right at 100 we’re killed, president, his family cabinet mil leaders. This IS a big deal. I’m asking myself about the timing of the accusation,,,,,,, why now?
Nations are choosing sides. Poland hates Russia and has for hundreds of years. Recall the 3 “Partitions of Poland” (1792 – 1795). Poland effectively disappeared from History for 123 years. And we must remember the Soviet depredations of Poland from 1939 until 1991. Poland might try to drag NATO into a war against Russia. The Polish elites have never been the most intelligent of Europeans.
ThisIsNotNutellaApril 12, 2022, 6:00 PM
“The Polish elites have never been the most intelligent of Europeans.”
Stalin certainly gave his qualified approval to this viewpoint. I’m inclined to agree although perhaps Katyn was a trifle extreme.
If you dig into the history of the partitions, the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth pretty much brought it upon themselves through being too retarded to figure out that a fractious layabout absentee landlord Szlachta, the Liberum Veto, and an elective monarchy FFS were anachronistic stupidities. They did good work stopping Trotsky’s red hordes with some French assistance after the First Great Unpleasantness. They they proceeded to screw every manner of pooch in every kind of position and largely brought September 1939 upon themselves by mishandling Gdansk *and* messing up Franco-Soviet rapprochements pre Molotov-Ribbentrop.
Ancient Hatreds have their uses, but it’s never good to get too high on your own supply. Personally I think the Hungarians got shafted more than any nation in that part of the world and they’re far more grudge-free than the Poles. Simply superior people.
Cool History that I had forgotten. I did recall Józef Piłsudski:
“Marshal Piłsudski…signed a military alliance called the Treaty of Warsaw with Ukrainian leader Symon Petliura. The treaty allowed both countries to conduct joint operations against Soviet Russia. The goal of the Polish-Ukrainian Treaty was to establish an independent Ukraine and independent Poland in alliance, resembling that once existing within Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth. The Polish and Ukrainian Armies under Piłsudski’s command launched a successful offensive against the Russian forces in Ukraine and on 7 May 1920, with remarkably little fighting, they captured Kiev.”
Poland probably dreams of marching to Kiev like in the good old days. Truly there is nothing new under the sun.
Those 10,000 killed by Stalin in the Katyn represented the best of the Poles. Taking them out of the Polish gene pool did that nation irreparable damage.
To this day the Hungarians remember the Battle of Mohacs (1526). Hungary suffered partition as well, but recovered eventually. Hungary is today the most normal country in Eastern Europe. She is, of course, now allied with Russia.
Ancient hatreds seem to have found a permanent home in the Balkans.
ThisIsNotNutellaApril 12, 2022, 6:56 PM
I was thinking more of American, err Wilsonian Humbug and the Treaty of Trianon Re Hungary being shafted. Turks Shmurks 🙂
Little known (because Inconvenient by the time the Victors got around to writing history) is that Poland was happy to partake in the 1938 dismemberment of Czechoslovakia:
Ceteris censeo if the USA deems it meet and proper that it have military bases all over the world and engage in regime changes and subversion of morality and the spreading of sodomy and other perversions, the odd PRC military transport flying into the Balkans shouldn’t get everyone’s knickers in a knot.
Casey KlahnApril 12, 2022, 6:15 PM
Dirk, they look like C-17s, but I quibble. They disappear over Turkey, and that is some shit right there.
This guy, MonkeyWerx, was over the bucket when Trump’s election was stolen and he had spooks taking ballots or computers or some shit into Germany. Does anyone remember that? I kind of lost some trust in him, although raw data is raw data and he delivers that like a fire hose. Very worth the listen.
Morning Casey, c-17 I can see the likeness, I’d read in the past, the design was stolen of the 141 just bigger. As for popping up. China uses a different IFF system, “ Identification friend or foe” which isn’t normally used in that part of the world.
They didn’t disappear they are clearly being tracked on flight tracker, but the tracking outfit had to engage a separate tracking system to “ ping “, China’s aircraft sqwak. All aircraft transiting are supposed to do this. But then who’s going to enforce the rules?
A decent article over on Thedrive.com. Perhaps one of the better sites for anything mil , and unusual.
I don’t know your guy. I’m sure he’s good. I’ve grown tired of these clowns with closets or bedrooms set up like a situation room spewing shit likes from gods lips to their ears, only. Phony fucks. Ego kills.
Would it shock me to learn a bit of propaganda’s involved. Frankly I’d be shocked it it wasn’t
Casey KlahnApril 13, 2022, 1:49 PM
MWerx says it’s like the C-17 but WTF do I know. He’s an air power buff, and I’m an air power critic. Might be the C-141; the idea is how China reverse engineers everything. That’s why they may destroy things but making them is a challenge.
I’ll check out that site.
However I think MonkeyWerx has seen transponderless traffic – I think the NA aircraft are no-call-sign, no flight plan military spooks. He says disappear but you’re right it’s some cloaking; the point is that Turkey allows it. Turkey is a double player and I’m rather sick of it.
I do know enough about air and anti air to know a few dozen SAMs in and of themselves are not a great threat. It’s the alliance/intention. Yes, propaganda abounds. That’s what intel is for; reading the tea leaves.
Have a good day.
GV, you have mail. More different links to the Y 20 info. The site source is very spot on, accurate.
Plan AccordinglyApril 12, 2022, 4:44 PM
Civil War Rwanda Bosnia style and WWIII are the last cards in the banksters deck.
How about that isolated and alone Russia led by the diabolical Hitler Putin.
Serbia hates NATO? I wonder why that would be. (sarc)
He also bombed a pharmaceutical plant in the Sudan (1998).
ThisIsNotNutellaApril 12, 2022, 5:49 PM
Perhaps the Serbs are worried that a @#$%ed up degenerate and desperate US President might invent some reasons to bomb them in order to distract the sheep-like US Public from the fact that they really ought to be marching on DC with Pitchforks.
I mean it’s never happened before.
Those Xi’an Y-20s are typical Chinese pragmatism. They don’t yet have their own domestically sourced high bypass turbofans so they got something working with what they *do* have (ancient but reliable Soloviev D-30 engines) and designed in an upgrade path so that they can swap out the engines when the new ones are ready. Amazing how you can get shit down in under 20 years when generals don’t have to over-spec everything cost plus to line up their post-retirement gigs. PLA was incredibly corrupt until the early 2000s — since then there’s been a big cleanup.
Casey KlahnApril 12, 2022, 6:28 PM
Serbs are some greasy sunsabitches.
Are the China missiles there to practice taking down Albanian planes? No, they’re there to flank Romania, which is a key NATO border to Ukraine. Does China (nee Russia) expect a hot air war with NATO?
Last week the rumor mill had this flight as carrying paratrooper Chinamen, which was absurd. I got off one of my best quips in awhile (Belgrade whore house…). Pats self on back.
Yes, extra SAMs in Southern Europe pointed at NATO is bad. Very bad. But more on the strategic level of whomst loves whomst. Because the Russians couldn’t wild weasel a wild weasel if its tail was caught in a jaw trap. NATO dominates Russia on land, in the Med and the Baltic Seas, not in the Black Sea because of Turkish whoredom, and in the air. But, like I said, alliances of China, little tiny and stupid Serbia, big smelly Turkey, comedically incompetent Belorussia…this amounts to a thing to worry about. If not for any aggregate strength they may cobble together, but instead for what it says about Russia’s intentions. Putin’s fondest wet dreams include riding the lead T-90 into The Hague.
Watching. Not sure what’s going on and so it is, what they say in the barracks, some shit, Private NumbNuts.
Sold by traitors. Recall Clinton’s 1996 deal with China and Loral Space & Communications. Lots of tech given away, lots of cash changed hands, and a few dead bodies strewn about. This treason allowed the Chinese to improve the accuracy of their ballistic missiles.
nunnya bidnez, jrApril 13, 2022, 3:51 PM
Treason you say?
Can we impeach Clinton for that now?
After all, the Democrats have already created a precedent that a >former< president can be impeached, at least once, probably several times if you can't make it stick.
Can we impeach FDR while we're at it?
I would start with John Adams for his “Alien and Sedition Acts” (1798).
bob sykesApril 13, 2022, 5:23 AM
The Chinese do steal anything worthwhile, and our Pentagon and military contractors make it easy with sloppy security, or none at all.
However, China has ten times as many engineers and scientists as we do, and numbers count. Their huge advantage in technical manpower means very rapid technological advances in all areas simultaneously. China now produces more refereed journal articles and more patents than we do. They have more supercomputers than us, and theirs are homegrown: chips, circuits, power supplies, operating systems. Until last year the Chinese had the two fastest supercomputers in the world.
Today China’s manufacturing sector is very high tech, more so than ours. Their manufacturing is also more diverse and more comprehensive than ours. They make many thing we don’t. For example, they have more high speed rail trackage than Europe. We have none. They also have maglev train routes.
China’s manufacturing sector comprises 30% of the world’s total capacity. It is 50% larger than ours, and it is growing 3 times as fast. In some areas they dwarf us into insignificance. They annually produce 35 to 40% of all the world’s commercial shipping, tied with South Korea. Our commercial shipping industry is virtually nonexistent. Even Russia’s dwarfs ours.
So, don’t be comforted by Soy Boy’s complaint that China stole the C-17. That is just icing on the cake of stuff they make themselves.
ThisIsNotNutellaApril 13, 2022, 3:50 PM
Yes. Bingo.
Boomers: You don’t have to like the Chinese. You can hate them all you want if that assuages the pain. But don’t let the Copeium cloud your perceptions and judgements.
Sure they steal stuff. So does Israel — who notoriously sold US tech on to China to help with development of the J-10 fighter. So does the USA when it can, for that matter. Everybody does. It’s the fool who gets stolen from who should be ashamed.
For the rest, physics and aeronautics don’t care about geography or politics. The Area Rule, Coanda Effect, stuff like that, plus the need for stealth, combined with computational modeling literally dictate that all aircraft of a certain size and function will look pretty much alike. It’s not 1935 and the Italians make the best-looking planes because well Italian. Of course it looks like a C-17 or whatever-the-hell… The maths says it must. Do you guys look at an Airbus A400M and see much difference apart from the turboprops? Engineering is engineering.
azlibertarianApril 14, 2022, 6:40 AM
…For example, [China has] more high speed rail trackage than Europe….
True, but China’s high speed rail system is one of the reasons that they’re headed over a financial cliff.
Real World Address for Donations, Mash Notes and Hate Mail
Gerard Van der Leun
1692 MANGROVE AVE
APT 379
Chico, Ca 95926
Green Pants Interior by Klahn
Who Am I? by Carl Sandburg
My head knocks against the stars.
My feet are on the hilltops.
My finger-tips are in the valleys and shores of universal life.
Down in the sounding foam of primal things I reach my hands and play with pebbles of destiny.
I have been to hell and back many times.
I know all about heaven, for I have talked with God.
I dabble in the blood and guts of the terrible.
I know the passionate seizure of beauty
And the marvelous rebellion of man at all signs reading “Keep Off.”
My name is Truth and I am the most elusive captive in the universe.
Duty, Beauty, Liberty, Country, Honor, Family, Faith — Plus a few simple easy to follow rules for guys
Men saw the stars at the edge of the sea
They thought great thoughts about liberty
Poets wrote down words that did fit
Writers wrote books
Thinkers thought about it
Take it where you find it
Can’t leave it alone
You will find a purpose
To carry it on
Mainly when you find it
Your heart will be strong
About it
Many’s the road I have walked upon
Many’s the hour between dusk and dawn
Many’s the time
Many’s the mile
I see it all now
Through the eyes of a child
Take it where you find it
Can’t leave it alone
You will find a purpose
To carry it on
Mainly when you find it
Your heart will be strong
About it
[Chorus]
Lost dreams and found dreams
In America
In America
In America
Lost dreams and found dreams
In America
In America
In America
And close your eyes
Leave it all for a while
Leave the world
And your worries behind
You will build on whatever is real
And wake up each day
To a new waking dream
Take it where you find it
Can’t leave it alone
You will find a purpose
To carry it on
Mainly when you find it
Your heart will be strong
About it
[Chorus]
Change, change come over
Change come over
Talkin’ about a change
Change, change
Change come over, now
Change, change, change come over
I’m gonna walk down the street
Until I see
My shining light
I’m gonna walk down the street
Until I see
My shining light
I’m gonna walk down the street
Until I see
My shining light
I’m gonna walk down the street
Until I see
My shining light
I see my light
See my light
See my shining light
I see my light
See my light
See my shining light
Gerard Van der Leun
Comments on this entry are closed.
What? A World War caused by some damn fool thing in Serbia? Like that’s never happened before.
“One day the great European War will come out of some damned foolish thing in the Balkans.” — Otto Von Bismarck
Amusing. This has been public knowledge for just under a week. China Y 20s, flew thru NATO airspace? Countries fly routes over countries daily. The load manifest was made public, the flight routes are open source on flight tracker. The flight, the cargo is nothing fishy, just taking care of business. What’s interesting is the likeness of the Y-20 and our own C141 aircraft.
I did not watch the silly stuff. But I’m guessing within the length of vid, the question of where are those missiles really going, was addressed. That’s the question.
Lady’s and Gentleman, like it or not WWIII has arrived.
AND today, the Polish Govt outright accused Russia of shooting down Polands leadership back in 2010. Think right at 100 we’re killed, president, his family cabinet mil leaders. This IS a big deal. I’m asking myself about the timing of the accusation,,,,,,, why now?
Nations are choosing sides. Poland hates Russia and has for hundreds of years. Recall the 3 “Partitions of Poland” (1792 – 1795). Poland effectively disappeared from History for 123 years. And we must remember the Soviet depredations of Poland from 1939 until 1991. Poland might try to drag NATO into a war against Russia. The Polish elites have never been the most intelligent of Europeans.
“The Polish elites have never been the most intelligent of Europeans.”
Stalin certainly gave his qualified approval to this viewpoint. I’m inclined to agree although perhaps Katyn was a trifle extreme.
If you dig into the history of the partitions, the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth pretty much brought it upon themselves through being too retarded to figure out that a fractious layabout absentee landlord Szlachta, the Liberum Veto, and an elective monarchy FFS were anachronistic stupidities. They did good work stopping Trotsky’s red hordes with some French assistance after the First Great Unpleasantness. They they proceeded to screw every manner of pooch in every kind of position and largely brought September 1939 upon themselves by mishandling Gdansk *and* messing up Franco-Soviet rapprochements pre Molotov-Ribbentrop.
Ancient Hatreds have their uses, but it’s never good to get too high on your own supply. Personally I think the Hungarians got shafted more than any nation in that part of the world and they’re far more grudge-free than the Poles. Simply superior people.
Cool History that I had forgotten. I did recall Józef Piłsudski:
“Marshal Piłsudski…signed a military alliance called the Treaty of Warsaw with Ukrainian leader Symon Petliura. The treaty allowed both countries to conduct joint operations against Soviet Russia. The goal of the Polish-Ukrainian Treaty was to establish an independent Ukraine and independent Poland in alliance, resembling that once existing within Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth. The Polish and Ukrainian Armies under Piłsudski’s command launched a successful offensive against the Russian forces in Ukraine and on 7 May 1920, with remarkably little fighting, they captured Kiev.”
Poland probably dreams of marching to Kiev like in the good old days. Truly there is nothing new under the sun.
Those 10,000 killed by Stalin in the Katyn represented the best of the Poles. Taking them out of the Polish gene pool did that nation irreparable damage.
To this day the Hungarians remember the Battle of Mohacs (1526). Hungary suffered partition as well, but recovered eventually. Hungary is today the most normal country in Eastern Europe. She is, of course, now allied with Russia.
Ancient hatreds seem to have found a permanent home in the Balkans.
I was thinking more of American, err Wilsonian Humbug and the Treaty of Trianon Re Hungary being shafted. Turks Shmurks 🙂
Little known (because Inconvenient by the time the Victors got around to writing history) is that Poland was happy to partake in the 1938 dismemberment of Czechoslovakia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Olza#Part_of_Poland_(1938%E2%80%931939)
Ceteris censeo if the USA deems it meet and proper that it have military bases all over the world and engage in regime changes and subversion of morality and the spreading of sodomy and other perversions, the odd PRC military transport flying into the Balkans shouldn’t get everyone’s knickers in a knot.
Dirk, they look like C-17s, but I quibble. They disappear over Turkey, and that is some shit right there.
This guy, MonkeyWerx, was over the bucket when Trump’s election was stolen and he had spooks taking ballots or computers or some shit into Germany. Does anyone remember that? I kind of lost some trust in him, although raw data is raw data and he delivers that like a fire hose. Very worth the listen.
Morning Casey, c-17 I can see the likeness, I’d read in the past, the design was stolen of the 141 just bigger. As for popping up. China uses a different IFF system, “ Identification friend or foe” which isn’t normally used in that part of the world.
They didn’t disappear they are clearly being tracked on flight tracker, but the tracking outfit had to engage a separate tracking system to “ ping “, China’s aircraft sqwak. All aircraft transiting are supposed to do this. But then who’s going to enforce the rules?
A decent article over on Thedrive.com. Perhaps one of the better sites for anything mil , and unusual.
I don’t know your guy. I’m sure he’s good. I’ve grown tired of these clowns with closets or bedrooms set up like a situation room spewing shit likes from gods lips to their ears, only. Phony fucks. Ego kills.
Would it shock me to learn a bit of propaganda’s involved. Frankly I’d be shocked it it wasn’t
MWerx says it’s like the C-17 but WTF do I know. He’s an air power buff, and I’m an air power critic. Might be the C-141; the idea is how China reverse engineers everything. That’s why they may destroy things but making them is a challenge.
I’ll check out that site.
However I think MonkeyWerx has seen transponderless traffic – I think the NA aircraft are no-call-sign, no flight plan military spooks. He says disappear but you’re right it’s some cloaking; the point is that Turkey allows it. Turkey is a double player and I’m rather sick of it.
I do know enough about air and anti air to know a few dozen SAMs in and of themselves are not a great threat. It’s the alliance/intention. Yes, propaganda abounds. That’s what intel is for; reading the tea leaves.
Have a good day.
GV, you have mail. More different links to the Y 20 info. The site source is very spot on, accurate.
Civil War Rwanda Bosnia style and WWIII are the last cards in the banksters deck.
How about that isolated and alone Russia led by the diabolical Hitler Putin.
Serbia hates NATO? I wonder why that would be. (sarc)
I had forgotten about Clinton’s air war in the Balkans. Yep, that hatred is well-earned. Can’t say I blame the Serbs.
Can’t blame China, either. Recall Clinton bombing their embassy in Serbia?
He also bombed a pharmaceutical plant in the Sudan (1998).
Perhaps the Serbs are worried that a @#$%ed up degenerate and desperate US President might invent some reasons to bomb them in order to distract the sheep-like US Public from the fact that they really ought to be marching on DC with Pitchforks.
I mean it’s never happened before.
Those Xi’an Y-20s are typical Chinese pragmatism. They don’t yet have their own domestically sourced high bypass turbofans so they got something working with what they *do* have (ancient but reliable Soloviev D-30 engines) and designed in an upgrade path so that they can swap out the engines when the new ones are ready. Amazing how you can get shit down in under 20 years when generals don’t have to over-spec everything cost plus to line up their post-retirement gigs. PLA was incredibly corrupt until the early 2000s — since then there’s been a big cleanup.
Serbs are some greasy sunsabitches.
Are the China missiles there to practice taking down Albanian planes? No, they’re there to flank Romania, which is a key NATO border to Ukraine. Does China (nee Russia) expect a hot air war with NATO?
Last week the rumor mill had this flight as carrying paratrooper Chinamen, which was absurd. I got off one of my best quips in awhile (Belgrade whore house…). Pats self on back.
Yes, extra SAMs in Southern Europe pointed at NATO is bad. Very bad. But more on the strategic level of whomst loves whomst. Because the Russians couldn’t wild weasel a wild weasel if its tail was caught in a jaw trap. NATO dominates Russia on land, in the Med and the Baltic Seas, not in the Black Sea because of Turkish whoredom, and in the air. But, like I said, alliances of China, little tiny and stupid Serbia, big smelly Turkey, comedically incompetent Belorussia…this amounts to a thing to worry about. If not for any aggregate strength they may cobble together, but instead for what it says about Russia’s intentions. Putin’s fondest wet dreams include riding the lead T-90 into The Hague.
Watching. Not sure what’s going on and so it is, what they say in the barracks, some shit, Private NumbNuts.
Stolen technology? …or sold by traitors?
Sold by traitors. Recall Clinton’s 1996 deal with China and Loral Space & Communications. Lots of tech given away, lots of cash changed hands, and a few dead bodies strewn about. This treason allowed the Chinese to improve the accuracy of their ballistic missiles.
Treason you say?
Can we impeach Clinton for that now?
After all, the Democrats have already created a precedent that a >former< president can be impeached, at least once, probably several times if you can't make it stick.
Can we impeach FDR while we're at it?
I would start with John Adams for his “Alien and Sedition Acts” (1798).
The Chinese do steal anything worthwhile, and our Pentagon and military contractors make it easy with sloppy security, or none at all.
However, China has ten times as many engineers and scientists as we do, and numbers count. Their huge advantage in technical manpower means very rapid technological advances in all areas simultaneously. China now produces more refereed journal articles and more patents than we do. They have more supercomputers than us, and theirs are homegrown: chips, circuits, power supplies, operating systems. Until last year the Chinese had the two fastest supercomputers in the world.
Today China’s manufacturing sector is very high tech, more so than ours. Their manufacturing is also more diverse and more comprehensive than ours. They make many thing we don’t. For example, they have more high speed rail trackage than Europe. We have none. They also have maglev train routes.
China’s manufacturing sector comprises 30% of the world’s total capacity. It is 50% larger than ours, and it is growing 3 times as fast. In some areas they dwarf us into insignificance. They annually produce 35 to 40% of all the world’s commercial shipping, tied with South Korea. Our commercial shipping industry is virtually nonexistent. Even Russia’s dwarfs ours.
So, don’t be comforted by Soy Boy’s complaint that China stole the C-17. That is just icing on the cake of stuff they make themselves.
Yes. Bingo.
Boomers: You don’t have to like the Chinese. You can hate them all you want if that assuages the pain. But don’t let the Copeium cloud your perceptions and judgements.
Sure they steal stuff. So does Israel — who notoriously sold US tech on to China to help with development of the J-10 fighter. So does the USA when it can, for that matter. Everybody does. It’s the fool who gets stolen from who should be ashamed.
For the rest, physics and aeronautics don’t care about geography or politics. The Area Rule, Coanda Effect, stuff like that, plus the need for stealth, combined with computational modeling literally dictate that all aircraft of a certain size and function will look pretty much alike. It’s not 1935 and the Italians make the best-looking planes because well Italian. Of course it looks like a C-17 or whatever-the-hell… The maths says it must. Do you guys look at an Airbus A400M and see much difference apart from the turboprops? Engineering is engineering.
True, but China’s high speed rail system is one of the reasons that they’re headed over a financial cliff.
https://youtu.be/eLCa6Vl7EeQ
Nothing to worry about as long as you
keep your powder dry and
your sourdough wet.