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Long Read of the Week: The Mathematics of Countering Tyranny by JAMES WESLEY RAWLES

Introductory Proviso: The following essay on possible gun confiscation is a purely conjectural gedankenexperiment about the future that extrapolates from recent history and current trends. Nothing herein is seditious (per 18 U.S. Code § 2384), nor a call to arms, nor a threat to our government or to any individual, agency, or group. [HT: Ol’ Remus RePost and eMail Widely]

The Collectivist Dream

The current mass media-driven “debate” on firearms (actually more like paternalistic lecturing or chiding) seems to be leading toward greater restrictions by Congress. The collectivist gun grabbers have the dream of ignoring the Second Amendment and somehow magically removing all detachable magazine semi-auto rifles from civilian hands. But it is just that: a dream. If they think that they can disarm us, then they are thoroughly deluded. I’ll explain why, with some simple mathematics.

The United States has the world’s first or second most heavily-armed populace, per capita. (It’s possibly second only to Yemen.) The number of FBI firearms background checks for transfers by Federally-licensed dealers from November 1998 to April 30, 2018 totaled 287,807,015. That isn’t all new guns. It of course includes many second-hand sales that cycled back through FFL holders. But it is still a staggering number. And it does not include any private party (“not through a dealer”) sales of used guns. That is thankfully legal in most states. Nor does it include guns that are legally made at home. (Typically made with 80% complete receivers.) Those home “builds” are becoming quite popular. Their ownership is mostly opaque to any would-be tyrants who might covet seizing them.

There are somewhere between 370 million and 420 million privately-owned firearms in the United States. Let’s just call it 400 million for a nice round figure. Most of those guns are not registered to particular owners. That is why there are only rough estimates. It makes me feel good to know that Big Brother has no idea where those guns are, and who owns them. When I last checked, the total U.S. population is 327,708,500. So that is about 1.2 guns per person. The adult population is around 249,500,000. And according to Wikipedia, the “Fit for service” Military Age Male population (men, ages 16-49) of the U.S. is just 59,764,677. That equates to 6.6 guns per Military Age Male in the United States.

Of the 400 million American guns, roughly 20% are single-shot or double-barreled, 60% are manually-operated repeaters (e.g., bolt action, lever action, pump action, or revolvers), and 20% are semi-automatic. There are only about 175,000 transferable Federally-registered full autos. That number would have been much larger by now but production was sharply curtailed by a hefty $200 tax (starting in 1934) and then there numbers were effectively frozen in 1986. It is noteworthy that if it were not for the National Firearms Act of 1934, selective fire guns would by now be in what the Heller decision calls “common use“. After all, it costs only a few dollars more to manufacture a selective-fire M16 than a semiautomatic-only AR-15.

With every passing year, the predominance of semi-autos is gaining for both rifles and handguns. (In sheer numbers produced, revolvers are becoming almost passé.) The biggest-selling handgun in the country is the Smith & Wesson M&P 9mm, followed closely by the Glock Model 19 9mm. Gaining rapidly is the highly modular SIG P320, which was recently adopted by the U.S. Army. All three of these are semi-automatic. Standard magazine sizes for autopistols range from 13 to 20 rounds. And the most popular rifles of the decade are AR-15s and their clones. Their standard capacity magazines hold 30 cartridges. (That isn’t “high capacity”.)

The Math On AR Clones

AR-15 and AR-10 variants are truly generic and have been sold under more than 120 brand names. The number of ARs (AR-15s, M4s, AR-10s, and variants) sold from 2000 to 2014 was approximately 5,672,900. Since then, AR-15 clones have become even more popular and ubiquitous with approximately 1.2 million more produced in 2015, 1.6 million in 2016, and 1.5 million in 2017. At least 1.2 million will be produced in 2018. It can be assumed that 99% of the ARs produced since the year 2000 are still functional. There were more than 2.3 million other ARs produced for the civilian market between 1962 and 1999. It is safe to assume that at least 95% of those of that vintage are still functional. So the total number of functional ARs in private hands in the U.S. is somewhere around 11 to 12 million. (As of May, 2018.)

Some Math on Other Semi-Autos

Next we come to the more fuzzy math on the wide variety of other models of semi-auto centerfire rifles in private hands. They include detachable magazine, en bloc clip, and stripper clip-fed designs. Here are some rough estimates. (Some of these estimates are based on my own observations of the ratios of different models I’ve seen offered for sale):

  • Various semi-auto hunting rifles (Remington 740/7400 series, AK Hunter, Browning BAR, Winchester 100, Valmet Hunter, Saiga Hunter, HK SL7/SL8, HK 630/770, et cetera): 2 million+
  • Ruger Mini-14 and Mini-30: 1.2 million
  • M1 Garand: 800,000+ (With many more being imported, soon.)
  • AK Variants (imported and domestically made, from all makers including Valmet and Galil): 2 to 3 million
  • M1 Carbine: 1.5 to 2 million
  • AR-180 and AR-180B: 35,000
  • M1A and other semi-auto M14 variants: 360,000
  • SIG 550 series: 80,000+
  • Thompson Semi-Autos (West Hurley and Kahr Arms): 75,000
  • HK variants: CETME, HK91/93/94 series, PTR91, etc.: 600,000 to 700,000
  • FAL variants: FN-FAL, FNC, and L1A1: 425,000
  • SKS variants: 1 million
  • Steyr AUG: 110,000
  • IWI Tavor & X95: 70,000
  • Various semi-autos assembled from military surplus full auto parts sets (M1919, BAR, Sten, M2 Browning, M3, Etc.): 75,000+
  • Assorted Other Models (These include: Kel-Tec, Barrett, Leader, FAMAS, Uzi carbines, Wilkinson, Feather, Calico, Hi-Point, SIG AMT, SIG PE57, SIG MCX, SIG MPX, Johnson, BM59, HK USC, TNW, Demro Tac-1, Calico Carbine, ACR, SCAR, Chiappa Carbine, SWD (MAC), Robinson, Hakim, Ljungman, Beretta AR-70, Beretta CX4, CZ Scorpion, Kriss Carbine, FN-49, SVT-40, SVD, PSL, Gewehr 41 & 43, Daewoo, FS 2000, Ruger PCR, Marlin Camp Carbine, et cetera): 2+ million.

The Aggregate GUN Math

Totaling the list above and adding it to the preceding estimate on ARs, there are 20 million semi-auto centerfire rifles that are in civilian hands here in the States. And that number is increasing by nearly 2 million per year. (More than half of which are AR-15 or AR-10 clones.) Again looking at the Military Age Male population (men, ages 16-49) of 59,764,677, that equates to roughly one semi-auto rifle for every three Military Age Males.
 

If a production and importation ban requiring registration were enacted, there would surely be massive noncompliance. For example, the registration schemes enacted in the past two decades in Australia, Canada, The Philippines, Indonesia, Brazil, and the States of California and New York have been well-documented failures. They have been met with noncompliance rates ranging from 50% to 90%.

Even with an optimistic 50% registration compliance rate, that would mean only 10 million of the nation’s 20 million semi-auto rifles would have a current name and address attached, to allow eventual gun confiscation.
 

Let us surmise that following several years of a registration scheme there were an outright “turn them all in, Mr. and Mrs. America” ban. I predict that even if $1,000 per gun were offered, no more than 11 million would be turned in, by compliant and history-ignorant Sheeple. (An aside: They’ll probably call this a “Buy Back”, but that will be a lie. They can’t “buy back” something that they’ve never owned.)

But that would still leave at least 9 million in circulation, as contraband.
 

The SWAT and ATF Manpower Math

So let’s suppose that a full Federal semi-auto rifle ban were enacted with a gun confiscation order issued.

This is where the math gets very interesting: There are only 902,000 sworn police officers in the United States. At most, about 80,000 of them have had SWAT training. There are only 5,113 BATFE employees–and many of those are mere paper shufflers. As of 2017, there were just 2,623 ATF Special Agents. The FBI’s notorious Hostage Rescue Team (HRT or “Hurt Team”) has a cadre strength that is classified but presumably less than 200 agents. Together, they comprise the pool of “Door Kickers” that might be available to execute unconstitutional search warrants.

If they were to start going door-to-door executing warrants for unconstitutional gun confiscation, what would the casualty rates be for the ATF, HRT, and the assorted local SWAT teams? It bears mention that the military would be mostly out of the picture, since they are banned from domestic law enforcement roles, under the Posse Comitatus Act.

The Division Equations

Next, let’s do some addition and then divide:

80,000 SWAT-trained police
+ 2,623 ATF Special Agents
+ 200 FBI HRT Members
= 82,863 Potentially Available Door Kickers

… presumably working in teams of 8, attempting to seize 9,000,000 newly-contraband semi-auto rifles.

Before we finish the math, I’ll state some “for the sake of argument” assumptions:

  1. That every SWAT-trained officer in the country is pressed into service.
  2. That there would be no “false positives”–meaning that 100% of the tips leading to raids were accurate. (Unlikely)
  3. That no local police departments would opt out of serving unconstitutional Federal gun warrants. (Unlikely)
  4. That all raids would be successful. (Unlikely)
  5. That each successful raid would net an average of three contraband semi-auto rifles. (Possible)
  6. That every Door Kicker would get an equal share in the work. (Very unlikely)
  7. That every Door Kicker would be alive and well through the entire campaign of terror–with no incapacitating injuries or deaths of SWAT officers, no refusals, no resignations, and no early retirements. (Very unlikely)

A lot of those are not safe assumptions. But for the sake of completing a gedankenexperiment, let’s pen this out on the back of a napkin, as a “best case” for an unconstitutional gun confiscation campaign. Here are the division equations:

9,000,000 ÷ 82,863 = 108 (x 8 officers per team) = 864 raids, per officer

Let that sink in: Every officer would have to survive 864 gun-grabbing raids.

Those of course are fanciful numbers. There will be a lot of false tips, and there will be many owners who keep their guns very well-hidden. Each of those raids would have nearly the same high level of risk but yet many of them would net zero guns. And it is likely that many police departments will wisely decline involvement. Therefore the “best case” figure of 288 raids per officer is quite low. The real number would be much higher.

How long would it be until mounting law enforcement casualties triggered a revolt or “sick-out” among the rank and file Door Kickers? For some historical context: Just four ATF agents were killed and 16 wounded in the Waco raid, and that was considered quite “devastating” and “traumatizing” to the 5,000-member agency.
 

Here is some sobering ground truth: America’s gun owners are just as well trained–and often better trained–than the police. There are 20.4 million American military veterans, and the majority of veterans own guns.

Resistance Strategy and Tactics

Rather than meeting the police one-at-a-time on their doorsteps, I predict that resisting gun owners will employ guerilla warfare strategy and tactics to foil the plans of the gun grabbers:
 
1.) They will successfully hide the majority of their banned guns. This is just what many Europeans did, following World War II. There are perhaps a million guns in Europe that were never registered or turned in, after the war. Particularly in Eastern Europe, Scandinavia, Spain, and Greece, there is still massive noncompliance. It has now been 73 years since the end of WWII. So the gun registration noncompliance in Europe is now multi-generational.
 
2.) They will form small, fully independent “phantom” resistance cells. This is commonly called leaderless resistance. Such cells are very difficult to detect or penetrate. These resistance cells will carefully choose the time and location of their attacks, to their advantage.
 
3.) They will individually target the legislators who voted for unconstitutional gun ban legislation. This will make it almost suicidal for these legislators to return to their home districts.
 
4.) They will individually target any outspokenly anti-gun police chiefs.
 
5.) They will target all BATF agents and FBI HRT agents–first with intimidation, and then with targeted killings.
 
6.) They will pillage or burn down the facilities where confiscated guns are being stored and destroyed.
 
7.) They will anonymously phone in false police reports about gun control advocates. (This is commonly called “SWATing.”)
 
8.) They will use time-delayed explosives, time-delayed incendiaries, time-delayed bursting toxin containers, cell phone-triggered IEDs, computer program worms and viruses, and long-range standoff weapons to minimize the risk of being detected, apprehended, or killed. Likely targets will be Federal buildings, courthouses, SWAT training facilities, police training ranges, and especially the private residences of anyone deemed to be a gun-grabber.
 
9.) They will use anonymous re-mailers and VPN to encourage others to resist by forming their own leaderless resistance cells.
 
10.) They will begin a War of Attrition on the Door Kickers, with tactics such as these:
A.) Ambushing SWAT vehicles while in transit, rather than waiting for the SWAT teams to set up raids.
B.) Ambushing individual SWAT team members at unexpected times and places–most likely at their homes.
C.) Sabotaging SWAT vehicles, most likely with time-delayed incendiaries.
D.) Targeting SWAT teams or individual team members while they are at home, in training, or when attending conventions.
E.) Harassing and intimidating individual SWAT team members and their families. The systematic burning of their privately-owned vehicles and their unoccupied homes and vacation cabins will be unmistakable threats.
 
11.) They will individually target “gun control” advocates, organizers, and group leaders.
 
12.) They will individually target the judges that issue gun seizure warrants.
 
13.) They will individually target journalists who have vocally advocated civilian disarmament.
 
14.) Some owners of M1 Carbines, AR-15s and HKs in the resistance movement will convert them to selective fire. (They will assume: “Well, if it is now a felony to possess a semi-auto, then what is the harm in making it a full auto?”)
 
15.) They will be willing to wage an ongoing guerilla warfare campaign using both passive and active resistance until the collectivists relent. This would be something like “The Troubles” in Northern Ireland, but on a larger scale, with greater ferocity, and with far more weapons readily available. Unlike the IRA, which had to import arms, all of the the firearms, magazines, and ammunition needed for any American resistance movement are already in situ. It is noteworthy that the agreed “Decommissioning” the Irish Republican Army (IRA) was delayed for more than five years because of their remaining caches of arms, which by then included only around 1,000 battle rifles!)
 

The Gun Confiscation End Game

I believe that once it was started, the whole affray would be settled within just a few weeks or months. American gun owners clearly have the numbers on their side. Once the shooting starts, the gun-hating politicians will quickly feel isolated, vastly outnumbered, and incredibly vulnerable. And when they realize they’ve lost their Door Kicker shock troops, they will capitulate. After some horrendous casualties in a brief but fierce civil war, the politicians would be forced to:
  1. Declare a cease fire and stand-down for all gun confiscation raiders.
  2. Repeal all Federal gun laws.
  3. Order the destruction of all Federal import, purchase, transfer, and registration records
  4. Issue unconditional pardons for all convicted Federal gun law violators.
  5. Declare a general amnesty for all involved in the resistance, and drop all pending charges.
  6. Disband the BATFE.

Without all six of those, the hostilities would continue.

But There’s More

The foregoing math on the roughly 20 million semi-auto rifles is not the full extent of the problem for the gun grabbers. Additionally, there are at least 50 million centerfire handguns that would be suitable for resistance warfare. (And another 3 million being made or imported each year.) There are also perhaps 40 million scoped centerfire deer rifles in private hands. The vast majority of those have no traceable paper trail. Fully capable of 500+ yard engagement, these rifles could be employed to out-range the tyrants and their minions.
 

Then there are the estimated 1.5 million unregistered machineguns now in the country. Except for a 30-day amnesty in 1968 that generated only about 65,000 registrations, they have been contraband since 1934. Their number is particularly difficult to accurately estimate, since some semi-autos such as the M1 Carbine, HK91/93/94 series, and AR-15 are fairly easy to convert to selective fire. Similarly, nearly all “open bolt” semi-auto designs are easy to convert to full auto. Large numbers of conversion parts sets have been sold, with little recordkeeping. Some guns can be converted simply by removing sear springs or filing their sears. Just a trickle of unregistered full autos are seized or surrendered each year. This begs the question: If Federal officials have been unable to round up un-papered machineguns after 84 years, then how do they expect to ever confiscate semi-autos, which are 15 times more commonplace?

As evidenced by the 1990s wars in the Balkans, when times get inimical, contraband guns get pulled out of walls and put into use. We can expect to see the same, here.

Now, to get back to the simple mathematics, here are some ratios to ponder:

  • NRA members (5.2 million) to Door Kickers (82,863) = 63-to-1 ratio
  • Military veterans (20.4 million) to Door Kickers (82,863) = 249-to-1 ratio
  • Unregistered machineguns (1.5 million) to Door Kickers (82,863) = 18-to-1 ratio
  • Privately owned semi-auto rifles (40 million) to Door Kickers (82,863) = 485-to-1 ratio

Unintended Consequences

The mathematics that I’ve cited don’t bode well for the gun-grabbing collectivists. If they ever foolishly attempt to confiscate semi-auto rifles, then it will be “Game On” for Civil War 2. I can foresee that they would run out of willing Door Kickers, very quickly.

I’ll conclude with a word of caution: Leftist American politicians should be careful about what they wish for. Those who hate the 2nd Amendment and scheme to disarm us have no clue about the unintended consequences of their plans. If they proceed, then I can foresee that it will end very badly for them. – JWR

End Notes:

Again, the preceding is a purely conjectural gedankenexperiment about the future that extrapolates from recent history and current trends. None of the foregoing is seditious (per 18 U.S. Code § 2384), nor a call to arms, nor a threat to our government or to any individual, agency, or group.

Permission to reprint, re-post or forward this article in full is granted, but only if credit is given to James Wesley Rawles and first publication in SurvivalBlog (with a link.) It must not be edited or excerpted, and all included links must be left intact.

 LINK: The Mathematics of Countering Tyranny – Gun Confiscation Fail – Rawles

Alert the Authorities!

Comments on this entry are closed.

  • Bill in Tennessee May 23, 2018, 7:18 PM

    Interesting article; however, in a SHTF scenario of door-to-door confiscation, I wouldn’t count on the Posse Comitatus Act from keeping the military out of the picture. Still, we outnumber them too; and how many soldiers and Marines would actually take up arms against Americans?

  • Casey Klahn May 23, 2018, 8:55 PM

    Bill, as an army national guard veteran, I can assure you that the army and the ARMG would not substantively involve itself in that kind of bullshit. Laws are laws, regs are regs, and “free-forming” events such as the illegal shooting of an unarmed rancher on an Eastern Oregon highway are possible for FBI and state police, but very unlikely for either military organizations or, for that matter, county sheriff’s departments. Although there are possibly many police organizations that would participate in gun control actions, my guess is that many wouldn’t. I could be wrong about that.

    What are the possibilities that at the CIA and the FBI right now, an insurrection against their own departments is brewing?

    Although old and enfeebled, I took to the field just today in chase of a mange prairie ghost whose been attriting my house cats, along with an increased predator population. The deer herds are decimated, too. Of course, I was armed only with my good looks. I don’t own any firearms because: culture. I’m more desperate to “fit in” than I am to breath free in the American heartland. I’m cool, you know? In the past 2 years, those deadly looks of mine rearranged the plans of varmints at greater than 300 yards. On snow. Twice.

    Veterans. They didn’t plan on us. Fucked up to the max, and mad at everything. Nice gun control plans you got there, congresswoman.

  • Casey Klahn May 23, 2018, 8:56 PM

    ARMG should read ARNG, Army National Guard. You know, the ones who fired the shot heard round the world at Concord Bridge. Kind of seems parallel to today, don’t it?

  • ghostsniper May 24, 2018, 4:18 AM

    They can’t round up 13 mill illegals but they’re gonna confiscate 300 mill guns, right?

    You already know the military WILL fire on citizens because they have ALREADY done so.
    Rarely do gov’t employees surrender that fat paycheck and all that goes with it.

    Anyway, the tyrants won’t go door to door because many of them will be killed.
    They’ll make it illegal for gun owners to renew any licenses, insurances, or enroll in schools, carry any gov’t insured loans, and a host of other gov’t “privileges” unless they surrender their guns.

    They’ll do this little by little, not all at once, so the herd won’t get too alerted.
    Remember, it’s for the children.

    Got your 80% lower?
    Soon those will be illegal too.

  • Bram May 24, 2018, 4:41 AM

    Former Marine and NG Soldier – trying to use the military to confiscate would not work at all. Units would come apart, in spectacular firefights in some cases.

    I can image small groups calling in false reports to the ATF, then ambushing them as the enter the house. Gets you dead traitors and free guns and ammo.

  • Bram May 24, 2018, 4:50 AM
  • Casey Klahn May 24, 2018, 5:03 AM

    Ghost, I think he said 400 million.

    You’re probably talking @ the Kent State shootings? The ones that happened the day after the students torched buildings? Threw stones and massed against the guardsmen? That one?

    Interesting point, though. I imagine the concept of the gubmint left would be to soften the target substantially in psychological terms, a la Vietnam era. Right now, gun control polls very poorly; they are losing on the PR front.

    That’s why I used hyperbole in my post. MF the Left. (starts with “mind,” ends with “f…”)

    The 99.99999% chunk of American history shows the armed forces to be solid and true. Vietnam was a low point, of a sort. There have been other dark eras for the US and its military; the Seminole Wars, and conscription during the Civil War among them.

    Never mind. Go smoke a bong and dream of the 60’s some more. I’ll be keeping my powder dry.

  • Tamquam Leo Rugiens May 24, 2018, 6:36 AM

    The problem of gun confiscation would be simplest in urban areas. They already have lists of gun owners from the FFL transfer data, so they can find you, or at least know who you are. With that in hand this is how I see it going down:
    1. Blockade the cities, stop food and fuel from entering.
    2. Set up government controlled distribution points inside the cities.
    3. Most city dwellers won’t have substantial stores of necessities such as food and on hand.
    4. People who show up at food distribution centers have their IDs checked against the FFL data.
    5. Want food? Turn in your guns or starve.
    6. Blockades won’t be 100% effective, but would be effective enough. Nobody wants to starve, still less to see their family starve.
    Sure, this would result in a lot of wastage, but the gov’t doesn’t care. Its all about power and control.

  • John The River May 24, 2018, 7:06 AM

    Those that have the guns, don’t starve.
    Blockade the food and create the mob that will either shot you in the head or hang you from a lamp-post in short order.

    Also holds true for ‘prepping’ for the apocalypse, stocking up with food and no means of defense is feeding the first men with guns and starving families that come by.

  • Fred May 24, 2018, 8:01 AM

    Casey Klahn said; “ARMG should read ARNG, Army National Guard. You know, the ones who fired the shot heard round the world…”

    Do you mean Sir, the same National Guard that shot those Americans at Kent State? That ARNG? Is this the same army that killed more people in a single mass shooting than anybody because the natives wouldn’t go be drunk welfare slaves on reservations fast enough? That Army? Or the army that rounded up all the Japs? That Army?

    The SJW’ing of the US military is well underway. It’s the last of the institutions in the long march. American soldiers will kill you if ordered and police already enforce every law on the books regardless how unconstitutional or unjust.

  • Punditarian May 24, 2018, 8:10 AM

    Agree with ghostsniper as to how it will be done but remember that a couple of divisions’ worth of ARNG and active duty USA personnel were deployed in Oxford Mississippi in 1962.

  • Buckeyebob May 24, 2018, 9:28 AM

    There are also very many of us ” grey men” out here in the farm country tending their plants and animals waiting for the spark of insurrection to ignite the flame of liberty again . Generational weapons and hurts are piled high and lists are already compiled of the orcs and their misdeeds awaiting justice . In my inner circle of friends and relatives we are mostly Irish and Cherokee descendants . What would you think our take on history would be ?

  • l2a3 May 24, 2018, 9:30 AM

    My worry about the Military is that they DO NOT any more teach the troops anything about ILLEGAL ORDERS. Why when ordered by the 05-06 officer or your Senior NCOs to shoot that unarmed civilian, you do not and you can tell them why that was an illegal order. All their threats are meaningless compared going to jail afterwards for murder. (Because they will throw you under the bus to save their own worthless hide.) I always was prepared to used this: “Sir would you please put that illegal order in writing for me before I follow it”. (99% of the time that stops the issue right there).

  • Roland Deschain May 24, 2018, 9:47 AM

    As per usual, the knuckleheads in D.C. have no idea of unintended consequences. Never have, never will.

  • Darrell Cloud May 24, 2018, 1:06 PM

    I found the video on the antiques that came of the attic to fight the Yugoslavian war interesting. The things that are hiding in American attics would amaze people. I had a buddy who had an extensive Nazi collection to include an MG 42. An unknown person left a British PIAT on his doorstep. ATF expressed no interest in it so he kept it.

  • Casey Klahn May 24, 2018, 4:10 PM

    I already covered Kent State. What else ya’ got?

    Fred, certainly you simplify the Indian Wars and make it hard to argue when there ain’t nothing said. We’re re-watching the Cavalry Trilogy, which lent huge cred to the Indians, as they well deserve. I also covered the Seminole Wars, already. Shit. Do you even argue, bro?

    l2a3, I was wondering the same. After My Lai, we were all taught about legal vs illegal order protocol. I am not going to assume that’s not known. The army changes veeeery slowly.

  • The other Fred May 24, 2018, 7:26 PM

    Good point on military training. In 2011, and attempt was made to teach Marines about lawful orders. An attempt was made to teach Marines about “imminent threat identification” in order to justify combat shooting (afghanistan) to the fullest extent of the rules of engagement. The D.O.S., at the request of the U.N. directed the Generals to cease immediately, any and all such talk. So Marines were not allowed to get any education beyond boot camp, about threat identification, or analysis. And being able to articulate the threat -training, just made the Generals ears turn publicly red! Even though they wholeheartedly agreed with the ideas. Teaching the military, (trained) law enforcement shooting policy was forbidden!

  • ghostsniper May 24, 2018, 7:58 PM

    @Casey: “What else ya’ got?”

    What l2a3 said 3 replies above yours.
    It’s not the same military now as it was when you and I were in, not by a long shot.
    Remember, they are getting rid of the grenade qualification, the standards have been reduced in all categories across the board to accomodate the lowest denominators, and finally, all americans born in the last 40 years have been heavily indoctrinated in all things anti-american.

    Now, you can continue to cling to your old fashioned idea of patriotism (I did for way too long) or you can get up to speed with the current reality.

    No matter which way it goes down I plan to be some where other than where it’s going down. I’m not going to be an easy target and I’m constantly evolving and reinventing myself.

  • azlibertarian May 24, 2018, 8:14 PM

    I’m of two minds on this topic. Like the author of the article, Schlichter, and all the way back to the Taxi Hack’s fare, the simple numbers indicate that any attempt by the .gov to confiscate anything is doomed. There are far too many guns in civilian hands to even think that they could succeed.

    And yet, a good number of years ago, the .gov did fire on a large group of not just citizens, but veterans.

    Oh, and one more thing…..it is mentioned briefly at the end of Rawles article, but I heartily recommend John Ross’s Unintended Consequences. I bought my copy at a gun show about 25 years ago, and even though used copies will fetch $150+ on Amazon, I think I’ll keep it to pass to my grandkids.

  • ghostsniper May 25, 2018, 4:55 AM

    You can get the pdf version here:

    https://billstclair.com/Unintended-Consequences.pdf

  • bob sykes May 25, 2018, 6:01 AM

    You have a units problem. This calculation is wrong,

    9,000,000 ÷ 82,863 = 108 (x 8 officers per team) = 864 raids, per officer

    However,

    (9,000,000 rifles)/(82,863 officers) = 108 rifles per officer.

    So, the units on the 864 are

    (108 rifles/officer)x(8 officers)/(team) = 864 rifles/team, not raids per team.

    Now, the number of raids will be the total number of rifles divided by the expected number of rifles per site:

    (9,000,000 rifles)/(no. rifles/owner) = no. owners

    (no. owners)/(no. owners/site) = no. of sites to be raided

    If you assume 1 rifle per owner and 1 owner per site, that gives you 1 rifle per site and 9,000,000 sites = 9,000,000 raids.

    More likely there will be multiple owners each with multiple rifles per site. I would think a typical site had around 3 semiautomatic rifles (plus other guns). So the likely number of sites to be raided is 3,000,000 sites = 3,000,000 raids.

    If each team had 8 members, then the number of teams is (82,863 officers)/(8 officers/team) = 10,358 teams.

    The number of raids per team is, (3,000,000 sites)/(10,358 teams) =290 raids per team.

    That is also the number of raids per individual.

    So, the average officer must survive 290 raids. Lower than your estimate, but still substantial. Considering what is likely, the average officer might get wounded or injured after a number of raids and might never see the full 290. There would have to be replacements.

  • Vanderleun May 25, 2018, 10:41 AM

    Interesting work Sykes. You might want to copy it and paste it into the comment thread at the original essay at

    The Mathematics of Countering Tyranny – Gun Confiscation Fail – Rawles

    That way Rawles can examine it and adjust his article accordingly.

  • Cancer Lad May 25, 2018, 4:02 PM

    They will use the few swat teams that are willing as long as they can. When the inevitable massacres happen, they will blast it on the news to justify allowing the use of foreign troops. While all the debate about legality and what troops from what country goes on, the sanctuary cities will hire mercenaries from Indonesia and Kazakhstan and where ever. They won’t use them within the sanctuary cities, they will send them out into flyover country to cause mayhem.

  • Casey Klahn May 25, 2018, 7:45 PM

    I think today’s veterans have a lot more in common with their grandfathers’ and great grandfathers’ generations, than they do with the Vietnam era generation. Not to disparage the Vietnam Vet, who is a quality person, but the generation is and was sub-caliber. I’m talking about the civilians and the nation as a whole. The Vietnam Syndrome still causes a drag on our American psyche.

    Today’s veterans, as far as I can tell, are a solid lot. I like the ones I see on the internet and although I see them in my community, I don’t have any real friendships with any of them. (you are right, Ghost, in regards to: who among us is as big a man or woman as our predecessors? Damn few are.)

    Jemez fucking cripes! I cannot believe someone brought up the fucking Bonus March!

    Your American military is the finest goddam institution that ever walked the earth. While individual results vary, as a whole and also in particular people, we are blessed with an armed force that obeys the laws, is constituted of our own people (esp. the national guard), and is not tainted in the same measure or way as Washington DC/Beltway government people are. Possibly West Point, and the other academies, are a bit blue in the blood and many are interested in state gravy. Those will by my persons of interest if shit goes south. They see themselves in the same stream as Harvard, etc. That is bad.

  • Casey Klahn May 26, 2018, 5:46 PM

    I want to add that I have known many West Pointers and not a few of them are highly talented and intelligent people. A few are Upper East Cost snots, with the same temper as the Ivy League Lib colleges. There it is.

    Vietnam veterans: epic dudes and my hat’s off to them. I have known dozens of them and admired 99% of them. Shit goes south: I want them in my foxhole pissed at the bad guy.

  • CJinPA May 28, 2018, 7:59 AM

    Good read, fake George Washington quote.

    Someone concocted it to help defend the second amendment, but only harm the cause once exposed.

    If you come across a perfect quote from respected figure that you never read before, it’s fake.