I'd take it in a heartbeat.

We've been looking for some acreage and Utah was one of the places we looked. The entire Moab area is unsuitable unless you plan to just rot in a hole. Take a look at the map. It's a hell hole. Northeast Utah is conducive but very expensive.

After examining the entire western area we have pretty much set our focus on southwest Colorado. Yeah, we know about the bad stuff but everywhere has bad stuff. You have to figure out what bad stuff is tolerable.

I want 50+ acres with the closest neighbor at least 30 minutes away, surrounded by large acreage owners. Natural water source and some flat land for a 1 acre vegetable garden. Lush hunting and fishing resources. We will be completely off grid.

After looking for 5 years this year is the time to do it. We ain't getting any younger.

My wife and I lived off-grid in mountainous Nevada at 6000 feet elevation for 18 years on 150 acres in a forty foot long travel trailer. Bears were our closest neighbors.

Snowed in and cold, cold winters can be tiresome. Fantastic experience and would do again if young. We learned how to survive under numerous tough times/close calls. Fools would drive off road vehicles (jeeps and snow machines) out by us and not come out alive in the winter. Culled.

I take off for a few weeks in Southern Utah, Northern Arizona and Southwest Colorado twice a year. What hell hole? What bad stuff? It is beautiful country. I try to explore more and find something new each trip. I could and would live there in a heartbeat but I'm quite happy where I am.

Beautiful country doesn't mean you can live there full time. The soil won't grow anything but scrub weeds and that's sort of important. Water is lacking. If you have massive amount of $$ you can make magic but that's not what we're about. We ain't Bill Gates ya know. Moab's a nice place to visit but then you go home.

Lived high in the Colorado mountains. It's a difficult place to live off grid. Doesn't take very many people to over fill the place and with the mass migration of California and East coast A-holes it's not the place it used to be.
Now live in SW Wisconsin on 20 acres. Closest neighbor is mile away. Weather great 10 months a year. Off grid entirely.
That hole in the cliff property I think has a major road running right in front of it. I remember seeing something like it a couple of years ago.
My recommendation for off grid living is upper midwest as you can't run AC off grid, nor can you irrigate very easily as you need to do out west.

Spent a lot of time 4-wheeling in Utah; parts of it are like roving on Mars,breathtaking. The Manti-La-Sal forest areas are gorgeous,thick woods,meadows,lakes and streams. Stumbled across a huge elk herd one spring. The locals were always nice,normal people,but Moab gets lots of annoying touristas,vegan bicyclist enviroweenies who sniff at fossil fuel drivers.

Hey! That's cultural appropriation. Anglos belong in boxes on the flat plains. Only Hisatsinom or opportunistic Diné are allowed to live in the red-rock canyons.

Besides, silly Anglos don't know the half of it. There are reasons best not talked about why the Hisatsinom took to the canyons. And more reasons why they abandoned them. Anglo archaeologists know or suspect, but truths must not be spoken!

And finally, while it may be a desert, there are reasons those caves are there. Water is involved. Lotsa water. Spider Woman and Thunderbird are not pleased, and will dispose of that Anglo trespassing in due time.

I do understand that if you are looking for a five acre farm that Southern Utah may not be the best place to look. But in fact there is water but you have to use it sparingly. Israel made the deserts bloom using what little water they have. This part of the country grows a huge crop of Anasazi beans every year. I think it has potential.

I don't understand what you refer to as "bad stuff".

Moab tourists are the life blood for the community. They come, the spend money and they go home. As far as their politics or proclivities I don't care as long as they don't physically or legislatively infringe on me.

If I were a young man (I'm 73) I would move to Moab or some other town in the greater four corners area. Beautiful country with a lot to see and do. Are there better places? Sure, but I really don't see the downside to this area.

Thanks Ghost- that Colorado Plateau country is beautiful, but challenges exist- especially growing crops at high desert/cold. Finding good dirt and water is best done by buying some property that already works, but then you are outside of your remoteness parameters, and thats not cheap, either.

Curious about your reference to "the bad stuff"-

The rez? Decades of dysfunction with increasing gang activity drugs and human smuggling along all of them close to the border, but not familiar with SW CO. One BI agent I know says dont EVEN think of driving thru NM rez at night, and they stick to the main highway in day.

Mining, gas and oil development?
Or FedGov land and water grabbbers?

Blue state growth? And tax trends - combination of bad ideas with net in-migration by dopers and other resource sucking demographics mean property owners and retirees on fixed income are gonna get tagged the worst, relatively speaking.

I am interested in your thoughts as I am also looking, have criss-crossed the Redoubt and parts of UT and CO, over last 18 months, curious about your parameters, happy to share if you want to share off-line somewhere else.

Concur on the bottomline- do your homework so no surprises- just have to plan ahead.

http://www.cairco.org/cairco-docs/npg_colorado_population_2050_good_intentions_bouvier_stein.pdf

Too old and inexperienced to do the off grid thing. Found a stilt home on the Gulf of Mexico bayou, florabama as its affectionately called. Good neighbors who live and let live. Too hot in the summer so we retreat to a little cabin in the North Carolina mts july/august. Again, good folks and low population on "our" mountain. Lots of water in both locations. Growing is easy on the gulf but problematic on the mountain but the valley neighbors produce well and we like to support them. Tried New Mexico a while back but locals were mean with the scarce water, not my kind of folks. I will travel to Moab for the beauty however.

@foodog, people in general are the general problem, and it spreads out from there. I lived 40 years in an area that was very high in transitional people - tourists. Unable to stand it any longer in 2006 I spent 1/2 a mil getting to a place I had ASSumed was not like that only to find out that it is but not as bad as before.

The Moab area has lots of tourism and a host of other things that are not good for a long term lifestyle.

Tourists, after studying them for decades, have a different mindset than residents. They get to leave after a spell and the rest of us have to stay and put up with the results of that way of thinking. Litter is a big one. No one litters like a tourist. No one. Abusive personality, smug arrogance, and a whiny child mentality. "I'm on vacay and I'll have it MY way or I'll have your ass!"

A good solar array can be created and there are stunning visuals in SW Utah but that is just not enough for us. People that have vacationed in the area do not present accurate depictions of what living there would be like.

"people in general are the general problem"

I get it, I don't like crowds. My favorite pastime is hiking alone or with my wife. However I can be at Grand Canyon (which I am twice a year for a week or so) with literally tens of thousands of other tourists and "I" am alone. I do sometimes choose to talk to some people, I occasionally even make the effort to smile and be friendly but in general I am alone even in a crowd or simply with my wife. People don't bother me and I don't bother them. Where is the problem? Sure I would prefer it to be like the old days before all these great places were "discovered" and tens of thousands of tourists were bussed in everyday, but those days are gone and I still intend to travel and go where I want to go. I know the roads less traveled and the sites and trails that few will go to and I'm happy with that.

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